Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-98.235.191.26-20140721085214/@comment-25206410-20140722050011

Matilda27593 wrote: About there being little to no character development:

Where would you like them to squeeze in more? You're already compaining that there's not enough action and too much HS drama. What you seem to have missed is that most of that high-school drama is character establishment and character development. If they cut some of the HS drama to put in more fight scenes, as you suggested, then there would be even less character development. The same thing would occur if they tried to put in more character development: there would be less fight scenes. No, they can't really make the episodes longer: they're already struggling with writing and animating one episode a week, and for good reason. As an author myself (of both fanfiction and original fiction), I could NEVER write a chapter per week, even if each was as short as the RWBY episodes, not to mention animate it and get the voices recorded, too. Also, this is only the first half of the first season: I don't see anything wrong with not having much character development. Before you have development, you have to have characters. If they had tried to establish all of the characters, there wouldn't have been ANY fighting this volume. As it is, Jaune got over his arrogance, Weiss got over her arrogance and began to care for her team and also loosened her hold on her bigoted views, Ruby learned about being a leader and started taking her studies more seriously, Blake started to trust her team more and learned more about how humans don't have it peachy keen either, and all of the characters' base personalities have been distinguished.

About the false advertisement:

I see where you're coming from, but I wouldn't say it's so far as "false advertisement." What was advertised with the trailers were teenage girls who used awesome weapons to fight supernatural monsters, androids, and other humans. What we got was just that; the only difference is the school setting, and that's not really "different," per se. In the trailers, it never said that there wouldn't be a school setting or high-school drama. It never said that the story would be about a journey of any kind. It never even really implied those things too much. Your argument about false advertisement is all about how you percieved these trailers. Myself, I watched the trailers one by one as they came out, and I actually expected it to be about a school setting. I can't really explain why--that was just the vibe I got from it. My point is: you can't claim it was "false advertisment" if the thing that they "falsely advertised" was never actually advertised. I can understand your frustration, but I don't think you can really call it false. "Misleading" is probably a better word.

About the dance:

Um... this was a few-second clip. I don't really think it was that important. You said that trailers are supposed to show the main points of focus, but I don't entirely agree. Sure, trailers should give a decent idea of what the show is about--and it did: it's about RWBY and co. fighting bad guys while having internal conflicts about whether or not they should wait to graduate like they're supposed to. But small clips like the dance clip that illustrate a few other plot points are also to be expected. Just look at, say, the Harry Potter and the Deathly Hollows trailer. There are clips of Hagrid flying his motorbike, of the Olivander stumbling through his wand shop, of Voldemort stopping a train, etc. None of those are "major plot points"-- they're just cool scenes of things that happened meant to create hype. The same can be said for the dance scene, the "Wolverine" scene, the falling from the sky scene, the "Weiss in Ruby's arms" ship tease, etc. I highly doubt any of these scenes are the "main focus" of the volume; they're just scenes of things that happened meant to create hype, like I said. Plus, a dance could add in some of that character development that you yourself said the show needed--not just for Pyrrha and Jaune, but for other characters as well.

About Summer Rose, Adam, etc:

Again, this is the first season we're talking about. I see no reason for any of the mysteries or enigmas of the RWBY trailers to be explored so soon. Then they wouldn't be as alluring and mysterious. It would be like if the Elder Wand was described in detail in the first Harry Potter book--it would take out the mystery and some of the fun. It's just like the "white cloak" in the Vol. 1 opening--if the first volume explained who this was, what they were doing, etc., then it would take out the intrigue, the spectulation, and the fun fanfiction. I have a feeling--one that's supported by the "Yang in the club" scene from the Vol. 2 trailer--that the mysteries of the trailers (Weiss's lonliness, Summer Rose, Adam, and the Transient Princess (the girl Yang was looking for; this name is confirmed by Monty, you should look it up on DeviantArt)) will be alluded to in Vol. 2 to create even more suspense, then be built up in the following volumes until finally being explained in a much later season.

About originality:

This one actually angered me when I read it, but I think you're perfectly in the right for making this complaint: I'm just tired of seeing it so much, so I'll try to keep this as unbiased as possible. If I fail, I apologize in advance. In any case, I don't see why originality is such a big issue for the RWBY fanbase. Sure, many things in RWBY aren't terribly creative; they've been done plenty of times before. But it doesn't really matter whether or not it's been done before. The quality of a show is just that--its quality. The characters and plot points can all be cliche as crap as long as they're either done very well or put a new and unique twist on the idea. I personally think that RWBY delivers on this. That is to say: it doesn't have to be original to be good, in my opinion. It's still funny, the characters are still likeable, the story is still investing, the fights are still awesome, etc. Originality, when it's there (like with the weapon design) is like whipped cream on the top. Calling something "unoriginal" isn't a true mark of quality--or lack thereof. Besides, there's nothing original under the sun. Just go on tvtropes.org and you'll see that almost every idea ever has been used and is known. I think we will have to agree to disagree on some of the character development, Weiss and Blake I both said did indeed get more develpment than most, and I forgot about Jaune to be honest. I disagree on Ruby, and the growth between the characters isn't really...shown? I realize that volume 2 will pry do more with this, and I mentioned that I liked this.

The runtime problem; this is the main reason I mentioned Rooster Teeth in my OP. I think Monty knew that a week wasn't adaqete, he's an experianced animator, but I think (pure speculation) RT would only give him funding if he released weekly. They get more money if there are more videos, bi-weekly would have better quality but less revenue if the project wasn't as popular as they thought it would be, which is less than it is now judging from their initial reactions to the fan outcry.

Now that RT seeing mechandice will make them more than enough money, they are happy to give Monty more funding and more time to increase quality. At the end of the day RT is a company, it needs money, and this project was rather risky for them, especially since they knew their fans are split between people who want comedy and those who do care about anime and such. (Super simplified version)

Just read the comments, they are not all trolls.

Overall, we will have to agree to disagree here or we will argue to kingdom come.

My criticism of Wolverine is mostly baseless, and since we are having a series discussion I will discard the petty gripe for what it is; a really petty and subjective gripe. Just know, when he is exactly like Wolverine, I will be saying told ya so.

The dance. That thing...

My main problem is that RWBY doesn't have the screentime any of those movies do, RWBY is working with a severly different formula in terms of presentation. This is problamatic, extremly so, and I don't think Monty realized how big of one it was until this volume. His specialty is combat, not lore or writing, and RT only maintains a group of VERY semi-serious writers. This has contributed to most of the negativity surrounding the series, in my opinon, and having a dance will only waste time, time RWBY doesn't have.

Honestly, I was a bit agresive in my inital post, but I do have more logical points behind the rage I decended into there. I wouldn't have complained too much about the dance outside of an eyeroll had RWBY had the time to spare. But RWBY doesn't, RWBY needs more development in shorter amounts of time, the Forever Fall episode did this growth best for me, and is a shining moment in the 'meh' that is Volume One.

On Adam, Summer ect.

Oh, I know that revealing your hand early is HORRIBLE for writing, but there wasn't even mention of the history these characters have. Just subtle stuff, like showing Ruby looking at a picture of Summer one night when she's alone, it adds a few seconds at most and is easy to animate, don't even need voice acting.

I wasn't looking for all out reveals, I was looking for subtle hints in the characters for signals of their pasts. As it stands Yang has zero history, Ruby is minimal, with Blake and Weiss somewhere between developed to a point and in a kind of "no mans land" mainly due to their trailers and the last two episodes. This is highly subjective, but I think this gripe has some objective truth to it.

Monty had more than enough episodes to just make SOMETHING get hinted at, he had time for a crappy Achivment Hunter referance, so he had time for more critical things too. I think this is my most valid criticism so far in this reply.

I'm saving false advertising for the end, onto originality.

I know that "nothing is original" has some truth to it, but it's not the godsend argument here. I really liked how they color cordinaded the team for their first names, some see it as a gimick, but I like it. This isn't original, I know, but the implimntation of it into the name of the show and team was another plus for me.

Ideas themselves are original, its how you impliment them. I think you alluded to this? I'm not entirely sure.

The main problem so many fans complain about a lack of originality is beacuse that's what we were promised. Monty and RT had quite the hype campain for RWBY once the first episode took off like it did. This came at the risk of building a fire they couldn't contain and deliver, they obviously dropped the fire extinguisher.

The main reason this originality problem angers me is beacuse RWBY lacks in just about every department where orginality can come shine through. They dropped the ball on dust being uniquie and not magic, they have yet to even TRY and explain aura in any adaquete capacity, semblences are cool but shallow super-powers with no real risk to using them.

As a fanfic writer, I've made more lore for the RWBY series than this entire wiki may have that isn't speculation. EVERYTHING on this site is speculation, in three months I've done more in my dwindleing spare time than a group of so called professionals could where they get paid to do what they do.

No, I didn't even plan my story out in the beginning, nor did I plan on it to have lore in it.

This, this is the most unforgivable offense Monty has done to this verse. He could have really made Ruby shinned had he just spent a few DAYS developing the lore of the series, and then making it part of the DVD box set in a small book or something. Hell, just hand out the damn things at RTX to those who come and allow for it to be posted after a certain amount of time.

You know what he did to create the map of Remnat? Put fucking ketchup on a napkin and played with it. This is ON THE RWBY WIKI SITE! This uninspired shit is what really pisses me off and-

Okay, calming down. I just think that Monty is doing a great diservice to us and the RWBY verse by not making a verse for these people to inhabit and connect with. I'll leave it at that. If you're curious about this fic I keep mentioning this wiki name is the same as my pen name. You can skip the first chapters if they're painful, they are pretty bad compared to my more recent updates.

As you can see, I think my rage on originality is more justified than you give it credit for, even with you saying it's right.

And the finale. The unethical advertising. I'm changing it to unethical due to the very specific nature of false advertising.

We fans need to really have a discussion about this; the ad campain, trailers, and merchandise are all unethical to the highest degree, and we need to stop feeding RT our money until they stop and deliver on what their ads proclaimed.

The items to buy aren't as bad at second glance, but they still give out the wrong impression for the show. Action figures, shirts showing epic stances or character intros, "It's also a gun". This all implies that RWBY is about combat, is about these girls fighting.

As far as I can see there is only one legitimate fight sequence, and that's with the grimm in the forest. The rest are short, sweet, and leave you NEEDING more. The grimm episode made me feel content from start to finish, even with the really cheesy animation and sometimes outright bad animation. I'm not going to complain about animation, theres no need to and it's silly to do so. I also grant the first episode a pass, forgot that one.

We combine the SELF PROCLAIMED trailers of RWBY and we have more non-stop action than the entire show. Most AMVs are just AMVs of the trailers in different order and music sync. How can you claim that RWBY delivered on it's promises? We were shown four badasses destroying man, machine, and monster.

We got instead an akward tween, a party girl, Ms. SIlent yet strong, and the stuck-up snob. All of them spending most of their time either decorating their room, being in melodrama, or doing slice of life crap. Again, I don't expect a fight every episode, I don't want one every episode, but I also don't want the complete opposite of what we were shown and hyped up for.

You misunderstand; I don't care that they are in a school enviornment, its not my place to critiquie a creators choice in envirnment for his show. I don't care that the characters are portrayed as they are in the show, nor do I care that it revolves more around drama than action.

What I care about is that this is not what we were shown, not what we were promised, and not what we were told. This is why I decimate all of these things in my rant above, had the anime been advertised as a school drama with an underlying theme for combat I pry wouldn't be writing this right now.

If I made this EPIC ASS trailer for a movie, and then released it WITHOUT ANY of the epic scenes in the trailer, can you imagine the kind of PR shit I would be in? I might even get a lawsuit or two filed against me.

How come when RT does it hardly anyone bats an eyelid? Also, yes, I deleted the parts of the comment you either agreed with me on or I conceded on in the quote part of this reply.