Talk:Cinder Fall/@comment-24834640-20180620211231/@comment-27144409-20180621150113

I'm leaning towards the villain end of the spectrum.

Compare her to an anti-hero like say, Frank Castle. Frank specifically targets loathsome criminals because he believes that they have to be stopped, and he doesn't trust the justice system to get things done, at least not fast enough. Some writers have showed him as fairly stupid, reckless, and blind to his sometimes hypocritical stance, but he tries to be selective in his targets. If there are civies near or within the area of a shootout he's in, he's going work harder to make sure he doesn't kill some poor bystander.

Raven, on the other hand, works with thieves, killers, and when it's convenient, human traffickers. She leads her precious tribe to attack civilians, knowing full well that their raids are likely to draw Grimm attacks. If she hasn't heard innocent kids screaming in terror while she used her Maiden powers, or even from her tribe approaching, I'd be shocked.

Admittedly she's not pure evil, and her skewed darwinist view would justify some of this in her eyes, but then there's the hypocrisy of her hanging with a bunch of losers who would have been used to wipe the the floor by a pair of huntresses who only had 1 year of formal training at an Academy and said losers would probably take heavy casualties attacking a well run and well prepared village before reteating.

There's very little for the current Raven that counts as a redeeming quality, whihc is kind of imporant for an anti-hero to work as a compelling character.