Board Thread:Speculation House/@comment-294840-20170719134411/@comment-294840-20170719164723

Arkantos95 wrote: Or, you know, he's just a rich, spoiled, smarmy little brat who got better treatment for never trying to rebel against Jacques. Maybe. But how often has RWBY led us in one direction about charcters only to later reveal another side about them. A side which WAS hinted at earlier and in hind sight we sould have realized.

Examples include the great Ironwood vs Ozpin debate from volume 2. Ironwwod may be gooing of the deep end now but in volume 2 he was simply some one who had a differnt opinon of things the Ozpin. Yet the show led us to Sypathize with Ozpin and either disagree or in the case of some people even outright suspect Ironwood. It wasn't until the attack in volume 3 that it became clear that both sides had a point. And that Cinder was able to play BOTH headmasters like a fiddle.

Another example is how often in Volume 1 Weiss had Jerkass Has A Point moments. Examples include when she points out how Ruby jumped in front of her attack at the beowolves and she had to redirect it at the last second in order to avoid setting hurting Ruby. While Weiss could have brought up the point better, it doesn't change the validty of said point. Yet how many first time watchers disregarded it  completly.

Another time Volume 1 Weiss had a Jerkass has a point moment was during The Badge And the Burden where she pints how Ruby has been acting like a child. Also I think it is telling is exactly what break's Weiss and sends her into the confrontation with the Borbatusk. While it is undeanble that jelaousy of  Ruby played a role in fueling her resentment. What BROKE Weiss was the fact that Ruby didn't take anything seriously. Just watch that scene if you have any doubts. Also listen to Ozpins advice to Ruby during episode. It is earily similar to what Weiss said. its just presnt in a more thoughtful way. That being that Ruby needs to take her role seriously.

So as we see it's not just character development that has changed our opinion of Weiss if we go back and look at early Weiss we see she often had a point. It's just the show was structured in a way to make us lean towards disregardiing it.

So now I have given examples of two charcters, Ironwood and Weiss who are initially made out to be unsympathetic, but who as the show goes on we learn not only aren't unsmpathetic but the signs to their good signs were always there to begins with. They were just cleaverly hidden. while it is possible that Whitley is a case of what you see is what you get it is also possible that he will be another case of betrayed expectations, and I have already set up my case for why I believe that is so.

Finally, this is only tangentally related but I want to talk about why I am looking for these possible aspects of  abusive relationships coming into play. This is because I am a huge have of the heartbreaking realistic fantasy manga (That's righ I said realistic fantasy manga. Bear with for a sec it will make sense soon.) Noragami. What I mean by realstic fantasy manga it that despite its fantasy trappings its has a heartbreakingly realistic portrayal of the way emotional abuse can have long term psycological effects on individuals and communities.

I don't expect RoosterTeeth to go to the same degree of realism that Noragami has gone to. For example Yato has been so emotionally devastaed by his father that he doesn't realize many of the wonderful talents he has such weaving, art, and math and believes he is only good for klling because his father carefully pounded it into his head that that was all he was good for for. His father also made it so Yato an EXTREME difficulty communicating with others as it was reinforced early on that communicating with others only brings pain, usually for the other party. While there are hints of a light at the end of the tunnel for this series it is still way darker then RWBY, and for that reason I don't expect everything to be the same. As obviouslly, Weiss is nowhere near as broken as Yato.

That being said while RWBY is going AS dark I DO so them going darker and more realistic then just having abuse as a genric background element as is common in many "anime".

For example both Yato's and Weiss's background consits of (some speculation is involved on the part of Weiss) alternating between rebelling aginst their father's and seeking praise  from them and they only finally suceed in breaking away completly once they have a strong support network. The degree to which this support network is needed differs per franchise but it is still aneeded in element regardless. They both had their dreams belittled by a controlling figure who WOULD praise them, but only to get them to do what then wanted them to do. And both had communication difficulites as a result of growing up under these figures. Though Yato to a MUCH greater degree then Weiss. This shows me that while RoosterTeeth may not be willing to go to dark they are at least taking tring to show SOEM REALISM in how abusive realtions are portrayed.

If you are wondering where this brings me to my specualtion about Whitley, well fans of the Noragami manga (the reason I refer to  the manga specifcally is that the anime has only BEGUN to touch on the Abusive behavoir of Yato's father) may know as Nora/Hiiro. For the purpose of this discussion you can considier her the counterpart of Whitley. Here's the thing. Both she and Yato are victim's of Father's abuse. However, where as Yato was given all the "acceptable" and quirky symptoms of abuse Nora got all the Negative qualites. Sound familar? Also some things you may want to know. Early on when Yato showed behavior Father frowned on he would often beat Nora. Yato was horrifed to see this and this was one of the many ways he tried to keep Yato as a killing machine. Bascially in Noragami Nora has been condtioned to at as Yato's ball and chain. After years of suffering Father's abusive Nora has come to have a severe lack of empathy,  and this has been EXTEMELY disturping to YATO. Eventually just like an alcoholic can not save himself if he is still hanging out with his alcoholic friends, Yato can not save himself if he is still hanging out with Nora and he is forced to let her go. Still it is important to remember that she is just as much a victim as Yato and she is more deserving of pity than contempt.

However, just as Weiss was much lighter than Yato. I believe it is quite possible that Whitley is much lighter than Nora/Hiiro. And that rather than lacking empathy like she does he is simply putting on a mask to protect himself. I have given my case for why I believe so above. Anyways sorry if the stuff about Noragami was a bit of a Tanget, but since it has impacted how I see the Schnee family dynamics as RossterTeeeth has chosen to portray them I thought it was worth including them. Also posted below will be two tmblr posts from which I took alot of research for how Noragami portray's real world abuse from.

http://echodrops.tumblr.com/post/134457026376/a-lot-of-thoughts-on-yato-and-father

http://echodrops.tumblr.com/post/134764155406/a-lot-of-thoughts-on-hiironora