Board Thread:Speculation House/@comment-27143816-20160216033644/@comment-25936766-20160615010154

The Devil&#039;s Advocate WP wrote:

1-Qrow came from a completely different direction. He may have been intended to meet up with her upon her return, but we have nothing to suggest he was traveling with her or monitoring her.

2-Hiding from airborne creatures is a little less complicated and becomes much easier upon reaching a forest area.

3-I don't think you can call it a human mistake... This is a matter of not really paying attention to what is going on around her, which is not a mistake that would normally be made by any experienced person.

4-The issue is that you have no grounds for making the assumption about Amber not being a huntress or soldier nor for assuming that she would fight the Grimm less either way. It is also not a reasonable assumption as she exhibited fighting experience and her Maiden abilities would make her far too desirable as a weapon against the Grimm.

5-You are obviously assuming that the force field-style deflections were Maiden powers, but I don't see any reason to think that is the case. She also very obviously had a staff with Dust on it capable of generating wind and fire.

6-There were like two seconds between the arrows lighting up and them exploding, assuming that it was not canonically more like a second.

7-Moving from branch to branch in a forest is not some mystical ability and it may not even require jumping, not that jumping from one tree to another requires any special powers either.

8-I don't think any suggestion I have made has been baseless. More importantly, I haven't treated any of my suggestions or assumptions as irrefutable facts when they are not.

9-This literally started with me talking about the potential implications, but again there was just this obsessive desire by certain people to ignore all that in favor of arguing why it is oh so totally wrong.

10-Are you finished projecting yet?

11-Wait, did you just suggest that even with Maiden powers it would be impossible for her to escape unless she could fly?

12-Maybe you don't get it, but there is not the slightest hint of civilian deaths even in this case. What we have seen from the Grimm indicates they are not so horrendously capable that anyone with decent training, experience, and ability, would have trouble getting away from them.

13-By Hunter standards Mercury, Cinder, and Emerald are all individually exceptional yet Amber still proved quite capable of taking them on even without her Maiden powers.

14-Assuming she's weakened.

15-Baseless assumptions.

16-Not at all. Anyone trained in combat is mentally trained as well as physically trained and part of that means being able to keep a cool head. She was generally cool-headed in the one fight we saw despite being ambushed, so it is not outlandish to suggest she could do it again. 17-You are assuming a lot of things right here, but let us just acknowledge that being experienced and capable with Aura does not mean fighting exactly like Lie Ren. He illustrates what is possible when using Aura on its own, but that does not mean everyone has to use it the exact same way. In the case of Amber, they would want her and any other Maiden to rely on more than just the Maiden abilities as that maximizes the chance of survival. That means also knowing how to fight with Dust, Aura, and without any of it at all.

18-No. We. Do. Not. How is it so hard for you to understand the difference between what we do know and what we don't know?

19-Maiden powers being attached to Aura does not immediately translate to Aura being attached to Maiden powers. No doubt it would easier for a Cimber to get away, but you have to cross the first hurdle of how Amber's Aura gets into Cinder. 1-It wouldn't make much sense for them to not have someone monitoring her, however, even if we discard Salem targeting her. Then again, Ozpin's geniusness makes this not-so unbelievable.

2-The problem is in getting to said forest, you know. She would still need to face multiple Grimm both swarming the air and flooding the ground. It's pretty hard to believe she could sneak past so many, unless she has some "invisibility Semblance".

3-For starters, I do call it a human mistake. It's not our fault we develop habits. She's not used to fighting with others, so she made a mistake, not paying attention to what Weiss was doing and fighting like she always does. It doesn't mean she is inexperienced. It only means she was inexperienced team-wise, not generally.

4-Yet you have no grounds on Amber actually being a soldier or Huntress and having as much, if not more, experience fighting Grimm as either of them would. Beyond just "she's so strong, she would obviously be used like a weapon against them!". If that's so, why doesn't Ironwood just send his entire army and fleet to wipe-out the Grimm? Far more numerous, less human casualties, more easy to replace.

5-For starters, I seriously question every time someone argues that a Maiden, that can control the different elements like the freaking Avatar, used Dust. Because it would be redundant, and extremely unnecesary, and even if someone questioned her dust-less powers, she can excuse it easily as "Dust Infusion/Clothing". Total, she has no reason to use Dust, and there's no reason to assume she did.

The force-field-like deflections may be the powers themselves, or may be just Aura. Either is possible.

6-Any person with the amount of experience you assume she has would have at least tried to move away at that moment. She didn't, she stood still without even a small hop back. No attempts to evade were made.

7-I know they don't require any special powers, but Amber doesn't strike me as dexterous or agile enough for that. Though I guess Wind can make it easy enough.

8-A good number of your assumptions are baseless, however. Hell, your Ambyrrha theory relies on a big one, as Ark had pointed out.

9-I suppose most people don't like to talk about the implications of a baseless theory that they see no reason for agreeing with.

10-Only if you are.

11-I said "if only by", not "though only by" or anything like that. Basically, that she could escape, at the very least, by flying. Because on the ground she has to deal with Griffons+Ground mooks. At least on air she only has to deal with 1 group until at least getting out of Beacon.

12-To assume there were no casualties in this case would shatter all suspension of disbelief. Breach had least had 2 excuses: Most Hunters were in the city or close to it, and the Atlesian Army arrived. In this case, far more Grimm broke in, even more came from the Dragon, and the Atlesian Mechs were hacked and started attacking everyone. It would be 400% unbelievable if no one died.

13-Even a mouse can bite a cat twice before being eaten; even a skilled fighter can be hit by someone far less skilled, even if not well-enough to be defeated. Also, when she used HtH, it was only against Merc and Emerald, not Cinder. And I don't think these 2 are anywhere close to Cinder's skill. Don't try to use their fight vs Coco&Daichi as "evidence", the fight was in their favor entirely (2 slow guys with heavy, slow weapons vs 2 quick fighters, 1 of which can make Delusions. The win was decided before it began).

14-Considering the state her body was in, and not just physically, it's not unbelievable if she was weakened.

15-Well, saying she can be sneaky-enough is already a baseless assumption.

16-Completely different situations kid, completely different situations. Comparing being attacked by 3 random people, even skilled ones, to waking up in the ruins of a wrecked sector filled with Grimm everywhere, is like comparing being slapped in the face to being ripped appart by a chainsaw. She may keep a cool-head in the former case, but that doesn't mean she would in the latter case.

17-My point simply was that we have no reason to assume she surely knows how to do an Aura Force Palm like Ren. Even if she does know how to use Aura, or Dust, or just plain punches and kicks, and is observed and possibly trained by the government for her own protection, that doesn't mean she would know every technique in the book.

18-And right now, you are proving to the world your hipocritical arrogance. We know it took her Aura, directly or indirectly, and part of the powers with it. Wanna go against canon, suit yourself.

19-If the powers were not attached to her Aura or at least Soul, then having them taken from her should not have caused that much damage to her, which went beyond physical. If the powers were not attached to Aura, then they would have no reason to pass her Aura to Pyrrha, for she would gain nothing at all except potential unknown problems.

How does Amber's Aura get into Cinder? The glove. Her Aura, or even Soul, was taken, and the Maiden Powers along with it. Taking into account the importance of the Soul in RWBY, it seems more reasonable. Even taking into account the transfer of her Aura to Pyrrha, and how both were incomplete, Cinder still clearly got the higher %. Pyrrha only got a bit. Beyond that, it's not really different from how the Ambyrrha Theory begins.

Besides, even if "Aura/Soul and Maiden Powers attached to each other" was an assumption, the contrary is also an assumption, a more baseless one in comparison.