Board Thread:Episode Discussion/@comment-148.253.184.233-20200128130653/@comment-14909251-20200211010615

Tough crowd here. I think this was one of the most solid Volumes overall, though the middle had some weak spots. Ending on a cliffhanger may be annoying, but I think it makes sense. Only issue is how they are going to make this fight last a whole Volume if that is their intent.

With Neo, I think the outcome made sense as her whole thing is using the opponent's power against them and her goal was to simply get the Relic and run, which her ability makes fairly easy, where they had to actually defeat her. There is also the whole thing of them having to run from authorities as well as fight off Neo. So, I think the outcome was kind of inevitable.

Penny becoming the Maiden was a tad surprising, though I figured Cinder would not get her hands on it this time either. However, it seemed to me it may have been more of an Aura transfer and that was suggested by Winter. If that was what happened, then it would seem she doesn't necessarily need Pietro to restore her by using his own Aura. Granted, she still has a bit of a death flag on her given two sides (Ironwood and Salem) want her power for someone else.

So, Watts living was entirely expected and I am glad he is alive because we have still not had that moment where all the members of WTCH are together and fighting as a team. Plus, we still don't know how he got in with Salem and that is important for confirming whether she actually manipulated events to bring him into her fold as she likely did with the others.

Ironwood not being willing to kill the vengeance-seeking criminal hacker responsible for countless deaths who works with the immortal witch bent on humanity's destruction yet being willing to kill a literal child is darkly humorous. One mitigating factor not being considered in him shooting Oscar, however, is that Ironwood knows perfectly well that Oscar and Oz are one and would just pass on to another body. For him, it may have been less like killing Oscar and more temporarily incapacitating him as he would eventually come back in a new body.

As for Cinder, people are wrong to suggest this is the first hint we got at her motivation and it is just not about power. I would say we got very strong hints at her motivation in Volume 3. Not just in Beginning of the End, but in her long speech in PvP. For a while I have suggested that her comments then may not have been just propaganda, but come from a genuine resentment towards the Kingdoms. Her comments in this episode clearly establish resentment towards Atlas, at least.

Cinder may have a special hatred for Atlas, but I really think her comments in PvP were a sign of general hostility towards the Kingdoms. It also established more firmly that her desire for power really is because she feels or felt completely powerless at some point. Given her allusion, it isn't hard to grasp where some of that comes from, but a general resentment towards the KIngdoms would suggest more is at issue.

One theory I have had is that Cinder may have once lived on that strip of green on the Black Dragon continent. We know from World of Remnant there were settlements there that apparently fell to the Grimm at some point. Given that continent is likely Salem's base and the most infested with Grimm, it may have been some sort of beachhead against the Grimm with multiple Kingdoms involved in its protection. My theory is that the Kingdoms abandoned these settlements or for some reason would not come to their aid, so they fell to the Grimm and that is when Salem met Cinder.