Board Thread:Episode Discussion/@comment-4141313-20190119003858/@comment-4141313-20190127174224

HotSwappableGaming wrote: BlizzardDragon wrote: 1. Now, I recognize the clear canon that Adam has been beaten by two huntresses-in-training. But whereas you think it's a testament to his lack of strength, I believe it's due to poor writing. Hence the core beginning of my initial argument, him fighting without using the remaining half of his weapon. Actually, most of my arguments reference that the issue is in the writing.

2. In terms of Cinder, you're arguing semantics.

3. I could define skill, combine it with his experience, and make an easy-to-sum-up talented fighter. I'll go into detail upon request. On a side note, your quote along with his later quote in the referenced episode illustrates why him 'seeing red' and not using his rifle makes even less sense. Just a fun observation when I was fact-checking!

As for Sun and Blake, you're saying that he's using tactics... combine that with innate skill, even as you reference it, and it sounds like he's quite a strong opponent, to me.

3. Now, as for the Tyrian comparison, I'm sure you're not deliberately ignoring the fact that Tyrian was fighting a tired team that had two volumes less of progression then Blake or... well, I'll say one volume for Yang. ;) Instead, I'll yet again attribute it to my root point of 'bad writing.' Adam shouldn't have lost this fight.

4. It doesn't make sense for him to because of how he's been built up. He can outclass Blake any day of the week, as we saw, but starts getting rammed up the ass when Yang gets involved. Now, let's ignore all the inconsistencies - The semblance that cut a droid in two only scraped an arm, the power-level progression, his character motivation - let me end my argument (at least in this response) with this. 1. Except most of your arguments seem to boil down to ''bad writing. ''Except if all the established facts of the series seem consistent with the argument that he isn't strong, then that doesn't come across as bad writing, but consistent writing. If you want to still call it bad, then fine, but its still consistent, meaning if its bad writing that Adam is weak, he's always been weak due to consistency.

2. How is that semantics? You said she went to Adam because he was strong, I said she went to him because she needed foot soldiers. That's not semantics. It would have been semantics if I said she went to him because he was powerful after you said ''strong. ''And its not a weak argument. Salem's, and by proxy Cinder's, entire plan is based around causing humanity and faunus to turn against each other and make it easier for her to best them. The White Fang are a notorious Terrorist group known for ultimately worsening the relationship between humanity and faunus kind, so recruiting Adam, who is extremely popular amidst the White Fang, would further that goal. Again, like Sienna points out:

Sienna: The destruction of the Huntsman Academies crosses a line! The loss of the CCT has brought global communication to a crawl! And the White Fang is more of a target now than ever before! You have justified humanity's campaign against us, and for what?!

So Adam was recruited for being a skilled leader, and with him leading the White Fang, Salem and Cinder can more easily divide humanity and faunus kind.

3. And once again, I feel I must point out that strength, skill, and tactical knowledge don't all mean the same thing.

Let's look at various characters that are tactical and skilled, but not strong.

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Shikamaru Nara of Naruto is a tactical genius and skilled with his Shadow Jutsu, but he is in no way ''strong. ''A hard enough punch or powerful enough jutsu being taken is enough to take him out or handica him. He's a great strategist and skilled fighter, but not a strong fighter.

Joseph Joestar of Jojo's Bizarre Adventure fights using tricks and technique, especially in the use of Hamon and his stand Hermit Purple, in stark contrast to both his father Johnathan and his Grandson Jotaro. He relies more on strategy and creativity to defeat his enemies, best evident in his fights with Nena and Mariah. He is skilled and smart, but not strong.

Master Roshi of Dragon Ball has lived for well over 300 years, and picked up his fair shair of tricks from doing so, and while he is a skilled martial artist, he is nowhere near strong compared to his fellow Z Fighters, even Krillin and Yamcha. However, he fights with skill and technique, which is ultimately why he becomes one of Universe 7's ten representatives in the Tournament of Power. His isn't necessarily strong, but he is skilled and technical.

Lelouch vi Britannia of Code Geass is a certified genius, being a great strategist and technical performer, such as using the absolute defense system of his Shinkiro. However, he is not only an average Knightmare Frame Pilot compared to his contempories Kallen, Suzaku, Rolo, and Xing Ke, he is physically weak, barely able to run for long, with even someone in a Victorian Style Dress able to outrun him. He isn't strong, but he's smart and skilled.

King Bradley is the weakest of the 7 Homunculi in Fullmetal Alchemist, being the only one limited by a human body, can't regenerate, and reliant on weapons. However, his skill with a sabre is monstrous, able to cut a tank shell in half with one, his ultimate eye lets him pick up on any weaknesses, and he's an absolute nightmare to fight thanks to his speed, sword play, and eye. He is by no means one of the strongest characters in FMA, but he's such a big threat because of his skill, his technique, and his speed.

Cao Cao of Highschool DxD is a human fighting amidst Angels, Devils, and Gods, and is fragile compared to them, losing both his eye and arm to one in a fight after only a single hit. Even armed with the True Longinus Spear, considered the strongest weapon in the series, he still isn't dangerous because of his strength, but because of his intellect and skill. He's fast enough that no one can land a hit on him easily, is able to read his enemies moves like it was nothing, identifies weakpoints easily and exploits them. and wields a weapon able to kill gods, but only if wielded properly.

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See? None of these characters are strong, but they are ''skilled. ''Adam can be skilled, but not strong. And yes, the show does support that Adam at the least is skilled. Iaijustu is not an easy style to practice, as the wielder must draw their blade swiftly and precisely, needing skill to use it properly, and Adam needs to be able to accurately block the attacks if he wants to charge his Moonslice. So Adam is skilled, but he isn't strong.

3. First, how was RNJR tired? They were walking through Oniyuri before being jumped by Tyrian, after having just rested at Higanbana. They weren't tired.

Second, how are you judging progression? Because RNJR had progressed too, and technically more than Blake cause for the entirety of Volume's 4 and 5, Blake wasn't training or anything, and I mention 5 because that is the same timeframe for 4. RNJR meanwhile had been training, with Jaune even getting good, and Nora upgrading her weapon to make better use of her semblance.

4. And that is the biggest flaw in your arguments. You are judging Adam based on the hype of other characters in the story, when the only characters who had reason to hype him up worked with him and had no way of gauging him against stronger characters. You argue he is own Qrow's level, but neither Blake nor Sienna met Qrow, so its unknown if they'd still consider Adam strong compared to Qrow.

And of course, the biggest issue with believing in the hype of a character: If the hype doesn't match up with what they truly are. Allow me to demonstrate with a character heavily hyped up.

The Character King from One Punch Man is hyped up as one of the strongest characters in the series, even called the strongest man alive, and by people that even rank higher than him in official rankings. However, not only does he only turn out to be a nicer version of Hercule Satan from Dragon Ball, all of his feats are simply from Saitama misattributed to him. He was hyped as strong by characters who had reason to hype him, but he wasn't as strong as the hype.