Board Thread:Speculation House/@comment-70.72.38.180-20150401032633/@comment-26206856-20150417063140

ChishioKunrin wrote:

Cinder (or her boss, if she has one?) was once a huntress who, like everyone else, believed that the kingdoms' governments valued all lives and tried to keep hunters from needlessly dying. But then she discovered that this isn't the case. Each kingdom's government sees hunters as sacrificial pawns to throw away as they see fit. She couldn't stand this, so she quit and sought to find a way to change things.

Fair point, fair point. Truth is I was extrememly tired and didn't feel like running through the song for Cinder in minute detail (I started to before, but found the links for Adam to be easier to back up with existing footage and actions.) Though we've seen a lot of Cinder, we still know very little about her, her background or her motives beyond speculation. The first few lines are so vague that they really could apply to anyone, which doesn't help matters. As for the 'sow the death then reap the seed' line, I think whatever connects to that line the best will probably hint at who the song is about.
 * Talking to the kingdoms' governments. The governments operate using ancient ways, from before the kingdoms became as strong and safe as they are now. They've become lost in their use of these outdated methods. They reap rewards from sacrificing hunters.

My question for really whoever we are applying the song to is: what rewards are being gained from the sacrifice/death?

Interesting theory about Summer. Though it works, I still want to think that she's truly dead and nix anything with her coming back. (Personal preference) Still, I could see them possibly doing something like that.
 * "You can't have my life. I'm not your sacrifice. You can try, but I'm free, and you won't conquer me. I won't crawl. Most of all, I won't fall for you." - She's free because she quit being a huntress, quit listening to the government. She refuses to be sent on suicide missions, sacrificed for the kingdom. Now, if this song is actually about Cinder's boss, and her boss is Summer Rose... Summer could've faked her death while on a suicide mission and has started operating in the shadows, using Cinder. She's free because the government thinks she's dead.

Overall, I think Cinder's plan may be to change things through violence. She intends to spark war, the kind of war that will tear kingdoms apart, and once the kingdoms are ruined, she intends to have them built back up into what she believes they should be. This completely explains how she and Roman got the White Fang to work with them. Although they're humans, they have a very similar goal and methodology to the White Fang. Both parties want to change things and are willing to use violence to do so.


 * WoR: Kingdoms ended with "They are the key to mankind's survival, as long as they stand united..." and the lights of each kingdom are blown out. This pretty much means that war between the kingdoms could tear them down.

Now, what would be really interesting is if Summer is Cinder's boss, and Raven helped them get that partnership with the White Fang, possibly even being the person who helped the White Fang's new leader rise to power. It would create a lot of drama, especially if Raven really is Yang's mother. I'm not sure I follow the logic completely here. I understand sparking war and creating conflict between the kingdoms to overthrow the government. However, tearing down a kingdom by overrunning it with grimm would almost completely destroy it to a point of no return, no matter what she did. My other question would be why she doesn't start up her own kingdom on the continent they shoved all the Faunus to (Menagerie), and just keep it separate from the other Kingdom's rule? Much like Austrailia used to be where all of England's deliquints were shipped to, and became it's own country.