Board Thread:Episode Discussion/@comment-4141313-20190119003858/@comment-38271940-20190201035525

BlizzardDragon wrote: HotSwappableGaming wrote: BlizzardDragon wrote: 1. Now, I recognize the clear canon that Adam has been beaten by two huntresses-in-training. But whereas you think it's a testament to his lack of strength, I believe it's due to poor writing. Hence the core beginning of my initial argument, him fighting without using the remaining half of his weapon. Actually, most of my arguments reference that the issue is in the writing.

2. In terms of Cinder, you're arguing semantics.

3. I could define skill, combine it with his experience, and make an easy-to-sum-up talented fighter. I'll go into detail upon request. On a side note, your quote along with his later quote in the referenced episode illustrates why him 'seeing red' and not using his rifle makes even less sense. Just a fun observation when I was fact-checking!

As for Sun and Blake, you're saying that he's using tactics... combine that with innate skill, even as you reference it, and it sounds like he's quite a strong opponent, to me.

3. Now, as for the Tyrian comparison, I'm sure you're not deliberately ignoring the fact that Tyrian was fighting a tired team that had two volumes less of progression then Blake or... well, I'll say one volume for Yang. ;) Instead, I'll yet again attribute it to my root point of 'bad writing.' Adam shouldn't have lost this fight.

4. It doesn't make sense for him to because of how he's been built up. He can outclass Blake any day of the week, as we saw, but starts getting rammed up the ass when Yang gets involved. Now, let's ignore all the inconsistencies - The semblance that cut a droid in two only scraped an arm, the power-level progression, his character motivation - let me end my argument (at least in this response) with this. 1. Except most of your arguments seem to boil down to ''bad writing. ''Except if all the established facts of the series seem consistent with the argument that he isn't strong, then that doesn't come across as bad writing, but consistent writing. If you want to still call it bad, then fine, but its still consistent, meaning if its bad writing that Adam is weak, he's always been weak due to consistency.

2. How is that semantics?

So Adam was recruited for being a skilled leader, and with him leading the White Fang, Salem and Cinder can more easily divide humanity and faunus kind.

3. And once again, I feel I must point out that strength, skill, and tactical knowledge don't all mean the same thing.

3. First, how was RNJR tired? They were walking through Oniyuri before being jumped by Tyrian, after having just rested at Higanbana. They weren't tired.

Second, how are you judging progression? Because RNJR had progressed too, and technically more than Blake cause for the entirety of Volume's 4 and 5, Blake wasn't training or anything, and I mention 5 because that is the same timeframe for 4. RNJR meanwhile had been training, with Jaune even getting good, and Nora upgrading her weapon to make better use of her semblance.

4. And that is the biggest flaw in your arguments. You are judging Adam based on the hype of other characters in the story, when the only characters who had reason to hype him up worked with him and had no way of gauging him against stronger characters. You argue he is on Qrow's level, but neither Blake nor Sienna met Qrow, so its unknown if they'd still consider Adam strong compared to Qrow.

And of course, the biggest issue with believing in the hype of a character: If the hype doesn't match up with what they truly are. Allow me to demonstrate with a character heavily hyped up.

The Character King from One Punch Man is hyped up as one of the strongest characters in the series, even called the strongest man alive, and by people that even rank higher than him in official rankings. However, not only does he only turn out to be a nicer version of Hercule Satan from Dragon Ball, all of his feats are simply from Saitama misattributed to him. He was hyped as strong by characters who had reason to hype him, but he wasn't as strong as the hype.

So Adam may be hyped as strong, he doesn't have to live up to the hype. Fuck that's a lot of text. Alright, gonna try and bubble down to main points.

1) I am arguing it's bad writing as my main point, but I'm also arguing he's not weak. Especially since your argument says that he's been shown consistently on a lower lever which it hasn't been. But we've done this dance, before. Yada yada spider droid, androids, yang's arm.

2) The semantics are the strength vs skill argument you made. The Salem touch is a good point, though. But we have no clear admition that that's her plan.

3) This entire argument is the first part of 2). When I say he's a strong fighter I don't mean he can bench-press a train. I mean he's a fucking good fighter. The semantics are, specifically, word choice.

3.2) Walking for miles and miles day after day tends to exhaust. Granted, this isn't directly stated and I'm assuming. And as for progression I'm judging it by what we see and how much they fight. We see RNJR do one fight and J do 1 session of training (though I'm sure he did more). Blake has been brawling with the White Fang, and Yang has been training with Tai. I get that between seasons we tend to get character progression in this show, but it doesn't make as much sense now. Especially when like all of their progression would have been off-screen for these recent volumes.

4) But he's not just hype. He's not King. He wasn't set up like King. He was set up like Saitama. ONE SLAAAAAASH! And their greatest flaw in writing with Adam, if he wasn't ever as strong as the hype in the first place, is that they set him up to fall down.

The greatest testament to this point is in Shane's letter - this fight was pretty much meant to be in volume 3. But it wasn't. And honestly, I liked Miles and Kerry's change more. At least, I did. Now it's just a bitter taste I'll have to put behind me. In the end they tried to carry on the rule of cool and wrote Adam's slash poorly in vol 3 or they wrote his death poorly. And honestly, I think it's the latter. Unless we get some flashback or source to Adam's scar then I can't imagine it being anything but the latter. It was all just so rushed and inconsistent.