Board Thread:Episode Discussion/@comment-25396609-20191130155818/@comment-44566359-20191207210446

Jonathan Mott wrote: Phantomlink959 wrote: I spend like 3/4 of my life concerned about other people.

Don't think anybody has called me effeminate for it. And you've just demonstrated exactly what is wrong with this picture.

Nobody is saying you have to be made of stone and only care about yourself to be a man. If Qrow spent this scene beating himself up over not being a good enough rolemodel to Ruby and the others in spite of their reassurances and resolved to do something about it under his own determination he would be acting like a man.

Men look after other people. That's what they do.

The reason this scene is emasculating for him is because he's over-eager to lean on Clover and Clover is over-eager to comfort him with soft words. This is the way women typically support each other.

The missing elements are dignity, responsibility, and self reliance. Not empathy. This is the big misapprehension that women make about men; that because they don't talk much they don't feel much.

https://youtu.be/QIAIk6secck?t=26

This would be like if All Might helped Deku pass his training by lifting the trash off the beach for him. It would make a mockery of Deku's attempts to change himself.

Clover is essentially robbing Qrow of his balls by absolving him of his weakness in a way that means he doesn't have to shoulder the problem himself. There's a great deal of sense to this, but it's not what a man needs to hear.

<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; line-height:normal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"">https://youtu.be/F2yBlbfVHrw?t=53

<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; line-height:normal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"">Obviously these two character have very different issues, but the principle as applied to being a man is the same. Clover saying, "You can do it, dude" like in the above scene still wouldn't be appropriate because Qrow is his senior. What he needed to say was that Qrow is being a pathetic little bitch and then encourage him.

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Hasn't Qrow beat himself up enough already? Since the beginning of the show, we met him when he was drunk in front of Beacon trying to start a fight with Wynter. Later on, Jacques picks a fight with Qrow because he went off the map (as he was searching for the Fall maiden) and they didn't know where he was/thought he was compromised.

His sister is playing out what they joined the academy for and he seems genuinely lost at how to deal with her (like the poor man looks so hurt everytime he sees her or talks about her), not the mention that he lost Summer and blames himself for everything because he believes his semblence is a curse. He almost died traveling with JNRR and has felt more useless than helpful the last few seasons.

This man is tired, spiriturally, mentally, physically, emotionally--you name it. He's fricken tired.

Believing that Qrow deserves to be told that he's, "being a pathetic little bitch" before he's deserving of encouragement, is toxic masculinity at its finest. Clover acknowledges Qrow's power, strength, and respects him but in the previous episode, Clover noticed that as a leader, Qrow was insecure about his semblance and is at a mental war. I mean, Qrow quit drinking after 7 seasons and you think telling him he's a little bitch is going to solve everything? If anything, Clover's response was what men need to do with eachother more. Qrow needs a new perspective so that he can grow and become stronger than ever and beat this mental block he got himself in. Clover is going to help Qrow in ways nobody has been able to offer ever before and we're finally seeing some character development from him that is positive and re-enforcing to his character. That's all :)