Board Thread:Episode Discussion/@comment-14138255-20160214165601/@comment-14138255-20160218002641

LiveandSound wrote: The Devil&#039;s Advocate WP wrote: 1-Being "idealized" or "considered perfect", are just traits. Take these Mary Sue traits like symptoms of a disease: You may show those symptoms and not have that disease, or have that disease but not those specific symptoms.

For example, the Ace is supposed to be perfect and idealized, but they aren't necesarily Mary Sues.

2-Pyrrha was designed as an MS from the start, who gets deconstructed later on. I'm saying that Ruby's display of unexpected powers far more powerful than even a Fall Maiden in Fall, plus out of nowhere, unexpectedly and suddenly, turning out to be from an ancient line of Ultra-Powerful warriors we've never heard before, puts her on the road to becoming a Canon Sue, with the only question being whether she truly becomes one or not.

3-It's not a subversion of DEM if the actual DEM turns out to be different from what could have been expected yet is still a DEM through and through. If she unleashed Maiden powers instead it would have still been a Deus Ex Machina played straight. And arguably, would've made her feel less Mary Sueish since at least she wouldn't be a descendant of the previously-nonexistant Silver Order that's far more powerful than Maidens. Well to be perfectly fair we are way too smart to have foreshadowing of any kind. If they gave us any lead, ANY lead, we would be able to deduce it before the episode aired. At least this way the impact and surprise is maintained somewhat.