Board Thread:Speculation House/@comment-34633327-20180125034140/@comment-34633327-20180127153335

Matsananimal wrote: KingFubuki92 wrote: Matsananimal wrote: #3. It isn't "No way in Hell" for her to being a Maiden, its "No way in Hell" that she was the last person on Cinder's mind. Cinder seems to have a very one track mind, ignoring rationality in favor of satisfying her Murder Boners for people.

She fucked up the plan for Haven just to get at Ruby, let her sadism make her cocky when facing Jaune, let her lust for power botch what should have been an easy mission to grab the Relic (And even if Raven and Vernal had still double crossed her, she could have froze Raven, forced Vernal to open the vault, then kill her and "Take her power" once it was open), and her shortcomings led to her defeat at Raven's hands. The last person on her mind is hard to tell, but she's so obsessed with power and revenge, I doubt Emerald, who she had no reason to be thinking about at the time, would be the last person in her thoughts.

#5. That wasn't a paranoid outburst. That was just an anger outburst. Talking to an asshat like Jacques can make anyone lose their temper. Look at the context of the scene:

''They separate, going in opposite directions. Weiss is soon creeping outside her father's study door when she hears a glass crash followed by the rising voice of James Ironwood. She crouches behind a cushioned chair against the wall''.

Ironwood: You need to control yourself!

Jacques: You're talking to me about control? Do you even hear what you're saying?

Ironwood: I am basing everything on my reports from your daughter.

Jacques: A daughter you stole!

Weiss moves closer to the door to listen.

Ironwood: Oh, we are not getting into that again.

Jacques: Oh, yes, we have far more pressing matters to discuss, starting with your apparent lunacy!

Ironwood: Jacques!

''The scene changes to an overhead view inside Jacques' study. He is seated at his desk while Ironwood has both hands on it, leaning over him from the other side''.

Ironwood: (sighing heavily) Winter is one of my best. If she's telling me there's a threat in Mistral then I am not going to take that news lightly. She's been there for weeks, people are mobilizing, sudden spikes in weapons and Dust trades. Someone is about to make a play and I do not trust Leo to stop them.

Weiss is listening outside.

Jacques: You've never trusted anyone other than yourself!

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Ironwood: (shouting) And for good reason!

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Weiss covers her mouth with her hand as she gasps at the sound of Ironwood slamming his fist onto the desk.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Ironwood: If Oz had just listened to me from the start...

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Jacques: You need to get a grip.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Ironwood: That's exactly what I'm doing. Our people need protection. By this time next week, the Kingdom of Atlas will be officially closing its borders. No one in; no one out. Without the council's permission.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Jacques: You mean, without your permission?

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Ironwood: And if that becomes the case, I would think you'd want to be on my good side.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> His outburst is more from Jacques claiming his idea is insane, when Ironwood is aware of the real dangers, but Jacques isn't and he can't tell him. It's a dumb plan in hindsight, but not an insane one. Ironwood does have Trust Issues, and those Issues led him to believe the best way to prevent an incident like Beacon, which was made possible by Leonardo letting three of Salem's associates masquerade as students, is to not let anyone unknown into Atlas. He can't trust their documentation since as Cinder, Emerald, and Mercury proved, said documentation is easily forged. So he keeps the Kingdom on Lockdown so he knows exactly who is in it.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> The hindsight part comes from the fact that in doing so, he's basically left himself trapped in a corner. SYUTK put it best.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> He recalled his men to maximize defense, that's cool....but he's also  ditching the very concept of information. He's literally trapping Atlas in a box: It might be closed, it might be hard to open, but everyone will be completely and absolutely blind to anything and everything that happens in the outside world.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Even developed, massively-industrial nations struggle to survive without outside help. Atlas is located in a freaking wasteland of ice and snow. Where the hell will they get their food? Unless he goes insane and just tells everyone to go eat Dust. "It's good for your health!".

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Unless he decides to use the Relic of Creation or something. But in the hands of a paranoid moron, that is a bad thing. There's also the fact that now he has absolutely no one to tell him what Salem and co. are doing.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> His paranoia leaves Atlas in a state of Information Darkness. Normally Paranoia isn't a good quality, but considering who the enemy is, and how easily they can sneak around in the darkness and destroy without anyone being aware, some paranoia is warranted. Now, had he left some Atlesian Specialists like Winter outside Atlas to do information gathering, it wouldn't have been as dumb a plan. His plan is just stupid, not insane. He isn't going insane, he's just making rash decisions. Which is what happens after you see an entire Kingdom fall to pieces against an enemy you know virtually nothing about and could potentially head to your home next.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> #6. But can any of the Villains reasonably kill him? Half his body is cybernetic, and Tyrian may be fast, but Ironwood is a goddamn Tank, so he can take the hits. Watts we have no idea whether or not he has combat skills, and Hazel's probably gonna be benched for a bit after what happened at Haven, needing to calm down. And the Grimm won't be an issue since Solitas is so cold most Grimm Freeze other there.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> As for Backstabbers, aside from Jacques being an asshole, who are these backstabbers? And Jacques has no power to do anything. He's a CEO, but Ironwood is a Council Member, one with Two Seats. So unless Jacques somehow plans on joining the council and overriding Ironwood, Jacques has no choice but to obey Ironwood's orders lest he be accused of Treason.

<p style="font-weight:400;">#7. Except they don't have the power to do so. Mantle is heavily implied to be on it's last legs: ''In time, it became apparent that the city of Mantle was living in Atlas' shadow. And so the decision was made to move the Kingdom's capital. Mantle was old news - and the Kingdom of Atlas was born. "A golden age of prosperity," they called it - but those left behind in Mantle would probably tell you it was the coldest winter they ever knew.''

<p style="font-weight:400;">Businessman : Well, I think the bigger issue here  is our society as a whole.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Jacques: (scoffing) Why, you mean Atlas?

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Businessman: Atlas, Mantle... You can't deny the economic disparity between the two.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Businesswoman: I mean, what exactly are you suggesting?

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Businessman: I'm just saying I don't think it's necessarily an issue of compensation as much as it is one of opportunity…

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> If Atlas is the Big City, then Mantle is the Ghetto (Implication is that most of the Faunus live in Mantle.)

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Ilia: (voiceover) We lived in Mantle with the other Faunus working the mines. But my parents wanted something better for me. They managed to enroll me in an  Atlas  prep school. Imagine that - a little Faunus girl from Mantle going to the city of dreams. ( sighs ) I felt like a princess.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> So even if they tried Guerilla Warfare, I doubt they have the weaponry to be a sufficient threat. And seeing as Ironwood is only sealing off  Atlas, then the people of Mantle shouldn't be able to get in either.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> #8 That's assuming Salem:

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> A) Even considers taking Adam in. She only needed him since he had the White Fang, and they made it clear not everyone will trust him after wanting to both blow up his soldiers, and abandon them when the going got tough.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;">Ilia:   He was the only one to escape tonight. Those in the White Fang that followed him? Won’t support a leader that abandons his people. He  won’t  have their help after this. He’ll have no one at all. And the White Fang will be left divided.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> He may have some supporters, but not enough for Salem to consider him valuable. She'd have no use for him anymore

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> B) Would let him go back to Haven.  Last we saw him, he was following Hazel and Mercury, so he either is sticking to Mistral and just hiding, or he's following them back to the Dragon Continent. As I've already highlighted how Salem has little use for Adam, he'd more likely be killed on sight. Even if she does find a use for him, he'd only get to go back to Haven if she allowed it, and right now, there is nothing of value at Haven. The Relic is gone, interkingdom communication is down so no one would know if Haven fell aside from Mistral, and they'd be on guard after the first attempt failed.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> He has no viable reason to be with Salem and go back to Haven. They contradict each other. So he either goes back to Haven on his own, which would fail since I doubt Ghira wouldn't be able to hold him off while the other students and cops show up, or go to Salem, who wouldn't let him go back to Haven just for revenge.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> So it isn't an inevitability. The situation is a contradiction.

<p style="font-weight:400;font-size:14px;"> #9. That isn't really channeling Game of Thrones then. Game of Thrones has named characters dying at any given moment, and the situation is usually bleak. Anime Game of Thrones is more like Akame Ga Kill, or Attack on Titan. What you described is more Shonen Anime in general, at worst Seinen Anime. Where is has a dark moment and characters can die.